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General Discussion

Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 10:48

nyerkovic	A month ago (probably more, sorry about that) you all gave us your thoughts about what was going on with the Forum Mods Team. You gave us feedback on what you thought was wrong and needed change and also gave us some solutions for it. We have been working with that information and decided some guidelines that will help us improve our FM work. Now we will cover the main issues that were pointed out by your comments and we will explain how things will work out from now on, this will provide consistency for most FM actions: 1. "We don't have to send you a PM" Issue: - All locked, but not binned threads should have a post at the end of the thread explaining why the thread was locked. In this situation, no PM needs to be sent since the reasons have been provided for all to read and should be clear enough so no questions arise. - In the event that a post has been binned a PM should be sent explaining to the OP why the thread has been nuked. The PM will also notify that if the OP has issues with the reasons they should submit a support ticket under 밊orum" and will be further reviewed. - Threads that contain Pornography, Hacking, Scams, Impersonation, Advertisements for other games, Excessive Profanity (at least 5), and Legal Action threads, will be binned without PMs. - PMs for individual posts that have been hidden should be sent always. However, in the event that a thread involves massive amounts of posts being hidden then hide all necessary posts and post a reply explaining the reasons that action was taken. 2. 밫oo many thread locking" Issue: - While the rules on flaming (zero constructive comments) should be continued to be enforced, we will try to let threads develop a little bit more. We will try to clean threads that aren뭪 too far out of the original thread and ONLY when they are truly derailed an no constructive discussions can take place, a thread will be locked. Offending authors will be warned in the final FM Reply post to the thread. 3. 밯e can뭪 speak about SDE" Issue: - This issue comes mainly because people don뭪 know how to address this topic. If you read the rules, constructive feedback is encouraged, which means an SDE thread is welcomed as long as it can contribute to an improvement. Express your problem and develop a solution to be worked on. - Never the less. What we will do with these threads is to edit the OP뭩 thread making sure it is contributing and not just cursing SDE/GMs/TNF etc. If there is something to be saved it will be and if not it will get locked. - We will lock the threads and tell the OP that the thread will be allowed as long as he/she modifies the thread to include constructive feedback. If the thread continues to do nothing but flame, post will be nuked. 4. 밫oo many stickies" Issue: - We will try and prevent stickies from taking up more than 40% of the space on the first page of any section. If something like this happens we will try and merge as many topics as possible into a metapost. 5. 밯e don뭪 know which FM edited my post" Issue: - We will leave a mark so that players know who and what was edited. Something simple such as 밇dited for xxxx - FMx" 6. 밳ou implement the rules as you want them" Issue - We will go over the currently existing Forum Rules, identify anything that is NOT clear and that needs clarification. We will update the forum rules once again to make sure that the definitions are clear to us and to the community. We will also update the rules to include some that have been announced but not written in the FR Document. Rule enforcement post-changes should be applied as consistently as possible understanding that all situations are different and that there will always be subjectivity in some FM actions. We will be giving more updates about this point as we keep working on this. Thanks to everyone that gave their feedback to us and made this work possible. Please remember you can always give new suggestions and feedback through regular channels like PMs to Forum Mods or by sending a Support Ticket under Forum. We will always read them and consider them. Also, if you ever feel the need to open a thread to give us feedback on what we are doing, please remember to give constructive feedback without flaming or ranting, you can express your point of view without it and we will understand. Sincerely yours, FM Team

nyerkovic

A month ago (probably more, sorry about that) you all gave us your thoughts about
what was going on with the Forum Mods Team. You gave us feedback on what you
thought was wrong and needed change and also gave us some solutions for it. We
have been working with that information and decided some guidelines that will help
us improve our FM work.

Now we will cover the main issues that were pointed out by your comments and we
will explain how things will work out from now on, this will provide consistency for
most FM actions:

1. "We don't have to send you a PM" Issue:

- All locked, but not binned threads should have a post at the end of the thread
explaining why the thread was locked. In this situation, no PM needs to be sent since
the reasons have been provided for all to read and should be clear enough so no
questions arise.
- In the event that a post has been binned a PM should be sent explaining to the
OP why the thread has been nuked. The PM will also notify that if the OP has issues
with the reasons they should submit a support ticket under 밊orum" and will be
further reviewed.
- Threads that contain Pornography, Hacking, Scams, Impersonation,
Advertisements for other games, Excessive Profanity (at least 5), and Legal Action
threads, will be binned without PMs.
- PMs for individual posts that have been hidden should be sent always.
However, in the event that a thread involves massive amounts of posts being hidden
then hide all necessary posts and post a reply explaining the reasons that action
was taken.

2. 밫oo many thread locking" Issue:

- While the rules on flaming (zero constructive comments) should be continued to
be enforced, we will try to let threads develop a little bit more. We will try to clean
threads that aren뭪 too far out of the original thread and ONLY when they are truly
derailed an no constructive discussions can take place, a thread will be locked.
Offending authors will be warned in the final FM Reply post to the thread.

3. 밯e can뭪 speak about SDE" Issue:

- This issue comes mainly because people don뭪 know how to address this topic.
If you read the rules, constructive feedback is encouraged, which means an SDE
thread is welcomed as long as it can contribute to an improvement. Express your
problem and develop a solution to be worked on.
- Never the less. What we will do with these threads is to edit the OP뭩 thread
making sure it is contributing and not just cursing SDE/GMs/TNF etc. If there is
something to be saved it will be and if not it will get locked.
- We will lock the threads and tell the OP that the thread will be allowed as long
as he/she modifies the thread to include constructive feedback. If the thread
continues to do nothing but flame, post will be nuked.

4. 밫oo many stickies" Issue:

- We will try and prevent stickies from taking up more than 40% of the space on
the first page of any section. If something like this happens we will try and merge as
many topics as possible into a metapost.

5. 밯e don뭪 know which FM edited my post" Issue:

- We will leave a mark so that players know who and what was edited.
Something simple such as 밇dited for xxxx - FMx"

6. 밳ou implement the rules as you want them" Issue

- We will go over the currently existing Forum Rules, identify anything that is NOT
clear and that needs clarification. We will update the forum rules once again to make
sure that the definitions are clear to us and to the community. We will also update
the rules to include some that have been announced but not written in the FR
Document. Rule enforcement post-changes should be applied as consistently as
possible understanding that all situations are different and that there will always be
subjectivity in some FM actions. We will be giving more updates about this point as
we keep working on this.

Thanks to everyone that gave their feedback to us and made this work possible.
Please remember you can always give new suggestions and feedback through
regular channels like PMs to Forum Mods or by sending a Support Ticket under Forum.
We will always read them and consider them.

Also, if you ever feel the need to open a thread to give us feedback on what we are
doing, please remember to give constructive feedback without flaming or ranting, you
can express your point of view without it and we will understand.

Sincerely yours,
FM Team

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 13:23

nyerkovic	I understand your issue with the blatantly part, and while what you say is true, this part refers mainly to topics that end up being a very clear and very grave offense usually turning into forum bans for people who make them. It would be very hard for a binned thread not to get a PM. For most if not all posts that are binned, people will always receive a PM. I will put that up for review to see how we can make that clearer. Yes, it is easier to say every action will get a PM, but it's not always the best thing to do. Easier doesn't mean best. Some people don't read PMs, that is a sad truth... I still have PMs I sent 2 months ago that haven't been opened by the receiver. If you lock a thread, people don't read PMs and open a new one again and again, after that you start binning and sending PMs... again, people don't read them but now instead of them thinking you are locking them because you want to, they think you don't want them to post anything which is not true. When that happens, other people not involved start seeing all this locking and binning going on and start thinking "what is going on here?".... rumors of why actions are taken start spreading because the initial offender didn't read a PM. In the end, the problem ends up being bigger. For that, the best thing to do is to leave the explanation in the end of the public closed thread so everyone knows why things were done... it's better than a PM. I agree sending a PM is easy and I will always do that, but its not the best solution most of the time. We don't want to avoid sending PMs it has never been the intention, we just want to use the available channels to communicate better why an action is taken. We thought about that point a lot, and if you wish to talk about it with me feel free to send me a PM because I would be glad to review your concerns. Most issues with consistency in actions should be resolved once the forum rules are reviewed.

nyerkovic

I understand your issue with the blatantly part, and while what you say is true, this
part refers mainly to topics that end up being a very clear and very grave offense
usually turning into forum bans for people who make them. It would be very hard for
a binned thread not to get a PM. For most if not all posts that are binned, people will
always receive a PM. I will put that up for review to see how we can make that
clearer.

Yes, it is easier to say every action will get a PM, but it's not always the best thing to
do. Easier doesn't mean best. Some people don't read PMs, that is a sad truth... I
still have PMs I sent 2 months ago that haven't been opened by the receiver.

If you lock a thread, people don't read PMs and open a new one again and again,
after that you start binning and sending PMs... again, people don't read them but
now instead of them thinking you are locking them because you want to, they think
you don't want them to post anything which is not true. When that happens, other
people not involved start seeing all this locking and binning going on and start
thinking "what is going on here?".... rumors of why actions are taken start spreading
because the initial offender didn't read a PM. In the end, the problem ends up being
bigger. For that, the best thing to do is to leave the explanation in the end of the
public closed thread so everyone knows why things were done... it's better than a
PM.

I agree sending a PM is easy and I will always do that, but its not the best solution
most of the time.

We don't want to avoid sending PMs it has never been the intention, we just want to
use the available channels to communicate better why an action is taken.

We thought about that point a lot, and if you wish to talk about it with me feel free
to send me a PM because I would be glad to review your concerns.

Most issues with consistency in actions should be resolved once the forum rules are
reviewed.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 13:00

Splid	You don't quite seem to be getting the point. The point is no matter what you post in your update of the rules, you will always have a phrase along the lines of: "Containing but not limited to...." Now unless you intend to write out an exhaustive list of EVERYTHING that is not allowed on the forums and EVERYTHING that constitutes "blatant" disobeying of the forum rules, it will still be on a whim. Are you going to do that Nyerkovic? Say, for example, that you do write an exhaustive list but for some unknown reason (for example) racism is not contained within the list. What happens when the player posts some racist abuse? Problem Number 1. So, you have written your exhausive list but then you realise that you are STILL having to interpret what is written. What if trolling is on the list of things that "blatantly" disobey the forum rules and therefore doesn't need a PM? Who decides whether something is trolling or not, and therefore whether it deserve a PM or not? The FM involved. And here we are back again at individual interpretations of what is and is not against the rules. Problem Number 2. It is FAR simpler to say that ALL Forum Actions (locking, editing, binning, moving, banning) will be accompanied by a PM. Isn't that nice and easy? It seems easy to me but you guys seem to want to skimp out of it...

Splid

You don't quite seem to be getting the point.

The point is no matter what you post in your update of the rules, you will always have a
phrase along the lines of:

"Containing but not limited to...."

Now unless you intend to write out an exhaustive list of EVERYTHING that is not allowed on
the forums and EVERYTHING that constitutes "blatant" disobeying of the forum rules, it
will still be on a whim. Are you going to do that Nyerkovic?

Say, for example, that you do write an exhaustive list but for some unknown reason (for
example) racism is not contained within the list. What happens when the player posts some
racist abuse? Problem Number 1.

So, you have written your exhausive list but then you realise that you are STILL having to
interpret what is written. What if trolling is on the list of things that "blatantly"
disobey the forum rules and therefore doesn't need a PM? Who decides whether something is
trolling or not, and therefore whether it deserve a PM or not? The FM involved. And here
we are back again at individual interpretations of what is and is not against the rules.
Problem Number 2.

It is FAR simpler to say that ALL Forum Actions (locking, editing, binning, moving,
banning) will be accompanied by a PM. Isn't that nice and easy? It seems easy to me but
you guys seem to want to skimp out of it...

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:44

nyerkovic	It is not up to FMs to decide on a whim what is and is not "blatantly" against the forum rules. ------------------------------------------------- This is exactly the reason for point 6. We want to review the Forum Rules so they are clear enough and all actions taken are not decided "on a whim". We have to make sure rules are followed, we don't have to create rules and don't want to create rules as we see fit. As for the PM issue, I see almost no situation where people won't be informed of an action taken. Public posts closed will have a Public answer, Binned posts will have a PM, Actions on individual posts ALWAYS gets a PM and Edits leave a trace of reason an editor. There is no situation where someone could say "hey, why did they do this with my post??" If you disagree, please send me a PM because I believe we covered the communication part with all this.

nyerkovic

It is not up to FMs to decide on a whim what is and is not "blatantly" against the
forum rules.
-------------------------------------------------

This is exactly the reason for point 6. We want to review the Forum Rules so they are
clear enough and all actions taken are not decided "on a whim". We have to make
sure rules are followed, we don't have to create rules and don't want to create rules
as we see fit.

As for the PM issue, I see almost no situation where people won't be informed of an
action taken. Public posts closed will have a Public answer, Binned posts will have a
PM, Actions on individual posts ALWAYS gets a PM and Edits leave a trace of reason
an editor. There is no situation where someone could say "hey, why did they do this
with my post??"

If you disagree, please send me a PM because I believe we covered the
communication part with all this.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:36

devildog8	I agree, posts that are deleted or edited needs to have PM sent, and a clear guidlines of what acceptable and whats not, because I see alot of flamming and bashing by some that get no attention or ignored by FMs and others get edited or deleted, if your going to clairify the rules make sure they are ment for all, and not just ones that dont have stature in this game bashing and name calling should be deleted reguardless of who it is, all rules must fit all and not some

devildog8

I agree, posts that are deleted or edited needs to have PM sent, and a clear
guidlines of what acceptable and whats not, because I see alot of flamming and
bashing by some that get no attention or ignored by FMs and others get edited or
deleted, if your going to clairify the rules make sure they are ment for all, and not
just ones that dont have stature in this game

bashing and name calling should be deleted reguardless of who it is, all rules must
fit all and not some

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:28

Splid	PM issue is still not resolved. Still there are occasions where no action can be taken. It is acceptable to post in topic if multiple replies are hidden, but this: "Threads that blatantly go against Forum Rules can be binned without PMs (those threads can be, but are not limited to: racist threads, personal attack threads, accusatory threads). If someone feels they are not posting against forum rules, please send a support ticket under Forum so the case is reviewed" is STILL unacceptable. It is not up to FMs to decide on a whim what is and is not "blatantly" against the forum rules. You guys seem to have gone away with the comments that were given and put as much work into making sure you still have loopholes to get out of sending PMs. Overall, a poor effort due to the intentional loophole, I can't wait to see the first thread disappear which a FM has decided isn't in keeping with the rules.

Splid

PM issue is still not resolved.

Still there are occasions where no action can be taken.

It is acceptable to post in topic if multiple replies are hidden, but this:

"Threads that blatantly go against Forum Rules can be binned without PMs
(those threads can be, but are not limited to: racist threads, personal attack threads,
accusatory threads). If someone feels they are not posting against forum rules,
please send a support ticket under Forum so the case is reviewed"

is STILL unacceptable. It is not up to FMs to decide on a whim what is and is not
"blatantly" against the forum rules. You guys seem to have gone away with the comments
that were given and put as much work into making sure you still have loopholes to get out
of sending PMs. Overall, a poor effort due to the intentional loophole, I can't wait to
see the first thread disappear which a FM has decided isn't in keeping with the rules.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:05

Sindher	Easily the best forum mod.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 11:26

richardphat	Well, I like people who takes seriously their job.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 11:09

nyerkovic	This is the work of all Forum Mods... I'm just the messenger.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 10:56

Rehor	I like nyerkovic. I am glad nyerkovic is a forum mod. Nyerkovic is cool.

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 10:51

nyerkovic	This post is a personal one, but related to the above. I would really appreciate if someone that feels some of the Forum Rules are unclear, they send me a PM with the rule that is not clear so we can review better. We know most of the rules and because of that, is kind of hard to know what you all fell that needs clarification. Thanks!

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General Discussion

Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 10:48

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 13:23

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 13:00

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 12:44

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 12:36

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 12:28

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 12:05

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 11:26

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 11:09

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 10:56

Re : Guidelines for FM Work 05. 30. 2011 10:51

Categories :

Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 10:48

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 13:23

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 13:00

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:44

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:36

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:28

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 12:05

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 11:26

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 11:09

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 10:56

Re : Guidelines for FM Work
05. 30. 2011 10:51