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What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 04. 2014 01:45
chrisb224455
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Hi,
So essentially I'm looking for some interpretation of the reposting of the stickied guide on abilities and some of the posts in this and the general tips and tricks forum.
I'm returning to the game (sort of) and trying to learn appropriate classing of crew members. For example, if restore and repair stats are contributed by all sailors and engineering is only contributed by engineers, should I avoid levelling any repairers or restorers and just class my support crew as engineers as quickly as possible? Should I avoid classing them in order to have more balanced stats?
If two gunners are all I'll ever need, will the starting 11/11 pair be sufficient to achieve good results at high level, or should I spend more time rolling for high repair and restore stats (I think the starting guys have 9 everything else)
To summarize, what do I need and when should I class it to form a BB crew? I intend to take as scout but know little else. Early games make SS look pretty dangerous - do people often take sonarmen or is that a waste of a support (engineering) slot? How many engineers are appropriate (I saw the diminishing returns described - is this still true?)
Thank you for any advice you can give.
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 04. 2014 03:26
EricIdle
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Some remarks on your post:
- yes of course you need repairers (but not restorers) if you use engineers classed on-time. If you don't level AA gunners, and you don't plan to go overboard with hypervetting, go for 7 engies / 3 repairs. Roll engies with 10/x/12 stats, they are better than elite engies. If you know what you're doing with sailor classing and stats, late-class engies. Be careful, though, you can end up with a messed up crew. I'd recommend against it. Late-classing also goes hand in hand with hypervetting (more than 200 vets per sailor), so if you're not prepared to hypervet, don't late-class.
- the only diminishing return for engies is for attaining the speed cap. For getting longer OH time, there is no diminishing return. And it's OH time that makes a difference in the end. That's why it is nice to have lots of engies, especially for UK.
- I'd say, don't use the yellow sailors. The best gunners for UK are 12acc/10rel classed as reload gunners, and +10 repair to go with them would be nice (or buy two acc elite ones, but they only have +9 repair base).
- If your scout has good repair base (+10 or +11), so much the better.
- A BB can't use a sonarman, if I'm not mistaken. In any case, don't sacrifice a support slot.
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 04. 2014 04:38
chrisb224455
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Thank you for the comments!
A quick followup question - which elite sailors would you recommend? You already said a pair of elite ACC sailors could be useful, although perhaps less so than 12/11/10+ acc/rel/rep. Are there other good choices? For example repairers or engineers? Or do they need balanced stats too much to be good to choose a 13/9/9/... base?
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 04. 2014 05:54
EricIdle
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Originally Posted by chrisb224455
Thank you for the comments!
A quick followup question - which elite sailors would you recommend? You already said a pair of elite ACC sailors could be useful, although perhaps less so than 12/11/10+ acc/rel/rep. Are there other good choices? For example repairers or engineers? Or do they need balanced stats too much to be good to choose a 13/9/9/... base?
For a BB crew, the only really useful elite sailors are elite repairs - to become repairers, obviously, or, if you are into that late-class optimise-repair thing, as BO, scout, and even gunners.
Elite engineers are inferior to 10/x/12 ones.
For gunners, realistically you could hope to roll 12acc/10rel with +10 repair. Anything even better is very rare indeed.
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 04. 2014 20:41
ErwinJA
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First off, the repair stat on a gunner is not that big a deal. A +9, classed on time, unboosted, will have 375 repair ability at level 120, with over half that being solely the result of the UK nation bonus. A +10 will up that to 495, and a +11 will go to 615. That's 480 ability in 2 gunners*. The 3 repaireres alone, if +10, have over 18 times that difference, and more than 20 times if elite. Add in the BO and engineers, and the 2 gunners aren't going to have a notable impact on repair, especially if you start ghosting them after they're capped. In fact, depending on your crew, you could reach the repair cap anyway and thus have the extra repair worthless.
I would much more strongly recommend elite gunners for UK. In other nations, it's not as big an issue and is more of a case of personal taste, but the UK's odd classing structure makes the extra points in the gun stats very valuable due to how long it takes to cap the gunners.
*Yes, boosting and vets/experts can significantly change the total ability, but we're working on ratios here, so that's irrelevant.
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 04. 2014 21:22
EricIdle
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Originally Posted by ErwinJA
First off, the repair stat on a gunner is not that big a deal. A +9, classed on time, unboosted, will have 375 repair ability at level 120, with over half that being solely the result of the UK nation bonus. A +10 will up that to 495, and a +11 will go to 615. That's 480 ability in 2 gunners*. The 3 repaireres alone, if +10, have over 18 times that difference, and more than 20 times if elite. Add in the BO and engineers, and the 2 gunners aren't going to have a notable impact on repair, especially if you start ghosting them after they're capped. In fact, depending on your crew, you could reach the repair cap anyway and thus have the extra repair worthless.
I would much more strongly recommend elite gunners for UK. In other nations, it's not as big an issue and is more of a case of personal taste, but the UK's odd classing structure makes the extra points in the gun stats very valuable due to how long it takes to cap the gunners.
*Yes, boosting and vets/experts can significantly change the total ability, but we're working on ratios here, so that's irrelevant.
Fair enough, Erwin.
But if you're talking ratios, then acc elites for gunners don't make much more sense than 12/10 ones, as both pairs, classed rel gunners, reach both caps around lvl 78-80, boosted, with 100 vets and nearly full experts.
And I'm of the opinion that reaching gunners' caps a level earlier just before BB3 is not as valuable as getting a little bit more repair. BVE'ed UK gunners with +10 repair give you around 1.5 million repair at lvl 120. But, hey, each to his own.
If I'm not mistaken, even with a 7/3 support crew you need around 150 vets on all of them to reach the rep cap at 120. So max out repair from non-support sailors and you don't need quite as many vets.
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 05. 2014 02:13
ErwinJA
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Originally Posted by EricIdle
Originally Posted by ErwinJA
First off, the repair stat on a gunner is not that big a deal. A +9, classed on time, unboosted, will have 375 repair ability at level 120, with over half that being solely the result of the UK nation bonus. A +10 will up that to 495, and a +11 will go to 615. That's 480 ability in 2 gunners*. The 3 repaireres alone, if +10, have over 18 times that difference, and more than 20 times if elite. Add in the BO and engineers, and the 2 gunners aren't going to have a notable impact on repair, especially if you start ghosting them after they're capped. In fact, depending on your crew, you could reach the repair cap anyway and thus have the extra repair worthless.
I would much more strongly recommend elite gunners for UK. In other nations, it's not as big an issue and is more of a case of personal taste, but the UK's odd classing structure makes the extra points in the gun stats very valuable due to how long it takes to cap the gunners.
*Yes, boosting and vets/experts can significantly change the total ability, but we're working on ratios here, so that's irrelevant.
Fair enough, Erwin.
But if you're talking ratios, then acc elites for gunners don't make much more sense than 12/10 ones, as both pairs, classed rel gunners, reach both caps around lvl 78-80, boosted, with 100 vets and nearly full experts.
And I'm of the opinion that reaching gunners' caps a level earlier just before BB3 is not as valuable as getting a little bit more repair. BVE'ed UK gunners with +10 repair give you around 1.5 million repair at lvl 120. But, hey, each to his own.
If I'm not mistaken, even with a 7/3 support crew you need around 150 vets on all of them to reach the rep cap at 120. So max out repair from non-support sailors and you don't need quite as many vets.
You're not inaccurate either. However, the chances of getting 12/10 gunners in a roll are already quite low, and ones with a good repair stat are exceedingly rare. Not impossible to find, but very rare. It's often easier to just get the elites. The big difference is you can ghost 13/11 gunners more to save weight, which is an issue on some ships. Also, unlike repair, the difference in accuracy will be noticed throughout much of the grind. Finally, while the repair cap is something many strive for, the actual difference between being at or near it is neither that significant nor going to make a difference that often. Truthfully, I think its overrated. A competitive player will still strive for it as another advantage they might be able to leverage, but I've never needed it ;-)
And, all else aside, I would be aiming for much more than 150 vets anyway, especially on engis.
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Re : What's needed for a BB crew?
06. 05. 2014 02:53
EricIdle
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Originally Posted by ErwinJA
You're not inaccurate either. However, the chances of getting 12/10 gunners in a roll are already quite low, and ones with a good repair stat are exceedingly rare. Not impossible to find, but very rare. It's often easier to just get the elites. The big difference is you can ghost 13/11 gunners more to save weight, which is an issue on some ships. Also, unlike repair, the difference in accuracy will be noticed throughout much of the grind. Finally, while the repair cap is something many strive for, the actual difference between being at or near it is neither that significant nor going to make a difference that often. Truthfully, I think its overrated. A competitive player will still strive for it as another advantage they might be able to leverage, but I've never needed it ;-)
And, all else aside, I would be aiming for much more than 150 vets anyway, especially on engis.
Agree with you on all points, especially on the objective of more than 150 vets on engies :)
But this is a personal preference, not something I'd recommend others to do (as it could be costly).
And I still have a pair of 12/10 gunner neuts with +10 repair that I don't think I'll ever need...
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