1. Proxi torp to learn ss1
2. Emden
3. Z99.

Why you people are still trying to factorize the user skills -which is utterly impossible
and unrealistic- when talking about ships advantages or disadvantages?

The topic was to discuss the long list of KM disadvantages and its counterparts of any
nation if you wish.

At any tier, from BB1 to 5, so far, there are no exploitable advantages for KM, but still a
long list of -very- exploitable disadvantages when facing a KM ship on the enemy line.

Masc24 meant it's how the game is programmed. Although I do think "final/striking
velocity" and "angle of fall" has something to do with it as well.

"Shell penetration is actually related to shell weight, not hangtime."

Shouldnt it be both?

Heavier shells = more speed when falling.
Longer Hangtime = longer way down to impact.
Combine those and Longer fall + heavier shell = more dmg.

I know, I know... this isnt realistic, but just because it isnt realistic doesnt mean it
SHOULDNT make sense.

Shell penetration is actually related to shell weight, not hangtime.

Any games with alternate 'characters' to choose from (ships for nf) have the
favourites despite the developer's attempt (do they even try?) to balance them. As
far as I know KM was never a user-friendly nation to start off with, and that has
moved nowhere with the recent inclusion of SN.

Claiming which ships of each tier is the best, largely based on personal experience
(whether by driving them, or observing others play with them) will only lead to ego
issues by offering wager games or endless arguments.

Most will agree that:
Shell damage - higher the better
Shell penetration - related to hangtime; if crappy, will largely negate shell damage
Range - higher the better; will vary depending rushing/running due to hangtime
Reload - faster the better
Turning force, Structural strength, DP - higher the better
Hitbox - smaller the better
Speed - higher the better; depends on crew stats, setup, displacement, etc.
Repair - crew dependent; nation dependent
Scouts - higher the better
AA - yes, is good (though range/damage/displacement variations?)

I'm sure there are more factors, sorry if I didn't mention everything. My point is,
some of those factors are simple right off the bat (e.g. higher shell damage is always
better), some will be highly player sensitive (e.g. long hangtime - good at
anticipating?) or player preference dependent (AA, more scouts, speed over repair).

But most of those factors that look good on paper will mean jack crap depending on
the situation. For instance in a GB situation when a true ninja ship gets a chance to
jump on enemy line, DPS would probably mean much more than crap turning force or
speed. (ninja Colorado with trips will easily clean BBs faster than a ninja H39)

And no one will deny single most important factor is the player's skill. If you are good
at masking the disadvantages and exploiting its advantages, good frigging for you.
That may make it a good ship for you, but that does not make it the best ship.

As far as this original post is concerned, KM's not the easiest nation to mask its
disadvantages and to exploit its advantages (what?) to make it a user
friendly 'good' BB nation for the most common GBII environment.

"Also, O1 is soooo much better than the Gneis." +1

In most fleet leagues, at least in my opinion, Vanny is a useless ship. Vanny is a ship
that has a role that sits somewhere in between two of the ships, and does neither very well.

L1 however, pretty much makes BB4s as interesting as they are, and the difference between
having good L1 players and bad ones is huge.

Also, O1 is soooo much better than the Gneis.

Personally, I love the IJN and KM SS machines...cannot wait to get to SS4 in KM line.

When I am 'dinkin around' I love the Kita.

The BB6 is awesome IMHO...and cannot wait for that grind, don't know whether I want Kaiser
or the ENG QV first...but is will be a long grind.

To me, a lot left...

O1 and Gneis are only the best BB2 in BB rooms where they can use the 11s and
have a considerable range advantage, otherwise I'd have to go with Fuso.

Then again, there really isn't a definite better ship in one tier, it all depends on the
situation.