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Meeting Actions - *Update 2*
12. 02. 2012 01:58
vick11
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Actions from the Fleet Leader meeting on 1st December:
1. Randy will request a specific update on the issue of HA:
- Core HA update and crashing issues.
- HA Battle Mode.
- Timeline and place in priorities.
*In progress*
*Update 2 - Very grateful for the reporting of HA bugs, please keep those coming in. The Devs are working to replicate those in testing to then continue working on solutions. There have been some changes introduced over the last couple of patches so any news on how HA is working would be welcomed on tickets.*
2. We will question SDE about the Achievement System that was on the original work plan for 2012. Is it still on the list or has it been removed, if still an aspiration what is happening with it?
*Update 2 - Investigation showed that the introduction of a meaningful achievement system within the current game engine would be a major project and so it was put on hold for the time being whilst other work is done. It may get reserected later.*
3. We will explore the possibility of a Poll system that pops-up at the Login page (only once per account for each Poll) to encourage greater participation in Polls.
*Being considered*
4. When the new Fleet Leader forum opens we will discuss topics for meaningful, constructive, Polls.
*Waiting for Fleet Leader forum area in new construct - second priority after Amazon project*
5. The Fleet Leader forum area is being worked on, but we will get an estimate as to when it may appear.
*No2 priority to Amazon - latest estimate is start of Feb 13"
6. The new Fleet Leader area will be permission based rather than automatically linked to account status. As such we will be able to consider cases for specific access beyond pure Fleet Leaders or Fleet Accounts if there is tangible benefit, eg some of the Testers on a case-by-case basis.
*As above*
7. Trainworld content is useful, but falling behind recent changes as it is not a SDE resource and very much reliant on a single person. Need to explore whether the asset can be incorporated to NF.com and kept upto date or elements of it replicated on the core site.
*Unfortunately SDE cannot take over the updating or content of trainworld, which is privately owned/operated/updated and thereby reliant on that person*
8. Update '/' commands in-game and in the guides. Anyone with input to that please forward to Head Moderator who will request the update.
*Passed to Devs - thank you for inputs*
9. Update and expand game guides. We intend to set work going on this with the revised Fleet Leader forum area (that will be read to all, write for Fleet Leaders).
*Some background work started on this (thanks to Lj and Darkfrost) - considering a way to get wider involvement ahead of FL area as well*
10. Explore whether the Test Server can be same loading as main game but then a branch option from the Login page to save having to use a separate client. There was a similar option in the past, can it be done again?
*Question asked - Waiting on response*
*Update 2 - although this was possible a few years ago for a short time, unfortunately it is not technically possible with today's version*
11. Forum Rules and Server Rules review, plus application of rules. We will open these discussions in the revised Fleet Leader area.
*Waiting on FL area - could be an agenda item for Fleet Summit?*
12. Randy will establish an issues update thread that he will endeavour to update weekly on any progress across a range of issues and questions so we can attempt to better track and communicate where we are on developments, timeframes and priorities.
13. We will consult SDE about producing a 'public' version of the Moderator Manual so players can better understand how TeamNF is constructed, how it works and its accountability, and the processes for complaint.
*Draft sent to SDE for consideration*
*Update 2 - Draft approved. Should appear as a pdf on the Download > Manual > Public Mod Manual link in the near future*
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On a side note, Randy talked about advertisement of the game through Amazon to attract new players and linkages with them on item payment. Hopefully there will be more news on this in the near future.
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 30. 2012 07:39
devildog8
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Originally Posted by vick11
I certainly dont want pity DD and I am not making out to be a victim, I know exactly why people have a go and quite often I dont blame them. However, there are times when the attacks are done with hidden agendas (let's say one in particular about getting me removed) and that is when it becomes pointless and destructive, as those that attempted it last time and the time before found out. You should also appreciate I have a reasonably thick skin so the last thing I need is sympathy from Fleet Leaders or anyone else.
There are calls for me to represent the community and all of it - so what I am doing here is actually representing that quiet majority (yes majority not minority) that dare not post here for fear of retribution, the majority that look at some comments on these forums and wonder why on earth members of TeamNF put up with it, the majority that support TeamNF and appreciate what the guys do for them. And yes I do research other game forums, otherwise I wouldnt make the comment. Yes I do research how many positive messages we get versus the few vociferous posters on the forums, so I can make the 'majority' qualified comment. Yes, I believe my 6 years in TeamNF gives me a reasonable feel for who are the majority and who are the minority and it does frustrate me when I know the majority are the ones suffering - the removal of the FL area being a classic case in point. Certainly when that returns it will be for the majority to gain good use from and we will not permit the destructive minority to spoil that one again.
As always there are some useful points in amongst this thread and I will try to capture those.
For Navyviper - I am deliberately waiting for the revised Fleet Leader area to take those forward. If you want to think of that as a launchpad for the new area and comms with Fleet Leaders then I think that would be a good analogy.
im not trying to get you removed, but as you can see the community has had about enough of the BS that SDE has been throwing at them for what 8-9 years now, thats almost a decade, surly as a company customer service should have improved instead of gotten worse, dont you agree?
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 30. 2012 08:01
ljsevern
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The majority of the community can't be bothered to post here Vick. And on top of this, a fair few people (myself included) represent fleets on here with large numbers of people.
Team NF members get support when they are active and help the community. I myself have given lots of thanks to those that have given up their time testing, helping ingame, active on the forums, refereeing. I'm sure you will admit that in the past, that hasn't always been the case with TNF.
Could you also do something about the destuctive minority/overzealous individuals (as you have put them) that stalk people/fleets on these forums, constantly derailing threads and flaming the people they don't like whenever they post?
On top of that, maybe a series of Teamspeak meetings would be an idea discussing certain aspects of the game (one for improving the experience of new players, one for HA, one for anti-cheating, one for forum flaming, one for fleet events) like we have seperate meetings for game balance? This would mean the actual Fleet Leader meetings would be more on topic and quicker, and with things specialised, hopefully more will get done. Maybe they can be led by the new sections of TNF. Furthermore there have been loads of suggestions (in the suggestions forum, or FLF, or even General Discussion) that have been flat out ignored; such as Splids suggestion of a questionairre being sent out to all accounts and past players asking what they think is wrong with the game and why they left, and what is good etc etc.
And regarding the removal comments; If you are willing to work for the community, be active on the forums and do what is needed to improve the game, then you shouldn't worry about people wanting you removed as you will always have the support of the community. Maybe you can build a bridge to those players who have asked for your removal by offering apologies and achknowledging mistakes?
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 30. 2012 09:49
vick11
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I am not worried Lj. I just wish they would turn that wasted energy to something more constructive, accept what they cant change and work with it as opposed to consistently trying to undermine the people trying to help.
As for suggestions they are checked out regularly, but as we said at the meeting we cannot respond to all of them, some are simply not possible and others are not taken forward for various reasons. A lot actually are over time. I am personally not keen on the questionnaire suggestion as the vast majority would just hit delete, quite a few would complain we sent it (we get that with the Newsletter), some would be just abusive and unfortunately the one or two decent comments we might get would probably be lost in the noise. That is only my opinion though as I do not know what was thought of it elsewhere. However, the concept of ignoring is a NF myth, a bit like not posting every minute of the day means we are not here.
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 30. 2012 10:10
ciscodelorum
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Originally Posted by devildog8
im not trying to get you removed, but as you can see the community has had about enough of the BS that SDE has been throwing at them for what 8-9 years now, thats almost a decade, surly as a company customer service should have improved instead of gotten worse, dont you agree?
This IS SDE we are talking about, right?
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 30. 2012 10:33
devildog8
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Originally Posted by vick11
I am not worried Lj. I just wish they would turn that wasted energy to something more constructive, accept what they cant change and work with it as opposed to consistently trying to undermine the people trying to help.
As for suggestions they are checked out regularly, but as we said at the meeting we cannot respond to all of them, some are simply not possible and others are not taken forward for various reasons. A lot actually are over time. I am personally not keen on the questionnaire suggestion as the vast majority would just hit delete, quite a few would complain we sent it (we get that with the Newsletter), some would be just abusive and unfortunately the one or two decent comments we might get would probably be lost in the noise. That is only my opinion though as I do not know what was thought of it elsewhere. However, the concept of ignoring is a NF myth, a bit like not posting every minute of the day means we are not here.
Vick the ppl that are trying to help are getting nothing resolved, this is the issue, like I said talk is talk, and if no actions happen then its just talk correct? even you have to admit this has been going on way to long, and all the talking is getting no results, this game is getting worse not better, hence the issues you have, you want ppl to channel their frustrations to more positive communication, well ill have to say and im sure I speak for most, you cant continue not to improve things and expect rainbows and sunshine, its like a car Vick if you ignore the issues too long the car will blow up and be usless, hence SDE has become a bad motor that they put band-aids on and expect it to purr like a kitten 9 years Vick, think about this, 9 years ppl have delt with this company taking a crap on their customers, and you seem to expect ppl to just deal with it, and trust me thats the attitude we are getting so dont come back saying SDE dosent think that, because they havent proved otherwise so plz get off the contructive comments resolve and start getting in SDE's ass to get to work, and stop all this fruitless BS coming into the game and fix the old issue that plauge it now once ppl start seen results then you can ask for calm, untill results start being shown, then expect more of the same, and you have no right to tell ppl they dont have a right to get mad, SDE is exploiting their customers, hence they are breaking their own rules and eula, so dont ask for players to follow what the comapny sets and break themselves
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 30. 2012 10:43
ljsevern
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Originally Posted by vick11
I am not worried Lj. I just wish they would turn that wasted energy to something more constructive, accept what they cant change and work with it as opposed to consistently trying to undermine the people trying to help.
However, I'm sure you can understand the frustration of people that feel victimised; Such as people being banned unjustly, or they feel that others get away with abusing them constantly. People do want to work with you Vick, you just need to open up a bit more and do that because even if you don't mean to, alot of your posts sound like you feel you are "above" the community and don't want their help, and don't need to appease them.
Originally Posted by vick11
As for suggestions they are checked out regularly, but as we said at the meeting we cannot respond to all of them, some are simply not possible and others are not taken forward for various reasons. A lot actually are over time.
I was grouping it together and I understand that they can't all be checked out regularly, but surely the high recommended ones can be highlighted, as well as other good idea's mentioned in this thread? Often we hear idea's are "passed to the GM's/dev's" but we hear nothing beyond that.
Originally Posted by vick11
I am personally not keen on the questionnaire suggestion as the vast majority would just hit delete, quite a few would complain we sent it (we get that with the Newsletter), some would be just abusive and unfortunately the one or two decent comments we might get would probably be lost in the noise. That is only my opinion though as I do not know what was thought of it elsewhere.
- Its the only feasable way with the numbers involved.
- Could be done included in a newsletter or purchase; to be honest, most other games I am registered in does newsletters/surveys/emails, people that complain should just put the email on the spam list. Maybe SDE could have an opt out option in the account settings.
- Should have an incentive to encourage participation.
- Positive phrasing so it explains its being done to benefit customers.
- Non-leading/non-bias questions to influence the outcome of the question.
- Free text comments are useful, but so are rating scales and selection boxes out of a number of options or 1-10 scale of satisfaction.
- Have questions aimed at different parts of the company.
Originally Posted by vick11
However, the concept of ignoring is a NF myth, a bit like not posting every minute of the day means we are not here.
Unfortunately it isn't a Myth; The amount of people that ask questions about the event ingame or on 3rd party forums is huge (which is why i've always said a properly done news page in the client is needed). There are many people that ignore the forums because of both ignorance (not knowing a lot goes on there) or their feelings towards them (either abuse from people on there, or being overwealmed and confused). But to find this out, a questionairre could be useful.
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 31. 2012 02:10
rnelsonbob
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I have been here for a couple of years now and i have seen all sorts of bugs and glitches and them annoyin crashes when in game for no aperent reason. I have been alot more active on the fourms latley doing alot of readin and all i can say is stop complainin so dam much its a game u are here to have fun and if u are not then do something else. this isent a mulit-million dollor game like microsoft or other big companys make where there is huge teams workin on it to perfect it for mass selling this is a "small" online game like so many others out there that probally will never be 100% or even close to being "complete". So back to what i wanted to say to begin with is that stop being so un-constructive on the fourms and when in meetings and take a chill pill the world isent going to end if u dont get what u want and i know ppl have been workin and askin for stuff to be fixed for a long time and it seems like it will never happen and who know mabye it wount but atleast we still have the "core" of the game to play and ppl we know to play it with. I think everyone needs to take a minute and remember when they started playin this and how much "fun" u had before u started to rage on here about stuff which if u think about it only makes u madder and lets u have even less fun playin this game. Now i know im not some "big deal" on this game or even a fleet leader but i have helpd alot of ppl who were startin or have been playin and idk anyone that will talk negitively of me for not being helpful so take what iv said here with a little salt and dont start ragin about how im a no-body and dont know anything about anything
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 31. 2012 04:41
ljsevern
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Originally Posted by rnelsonbob
I have been here for a couple of years now and i have seen all sorts of bugs and glitches and them annoyin crashes when in game for no aperent reason. I have been alot more active on the fourms latley doing alot of readin and all i can say is stop complainin so dam much its a game u are here to have fun and if u are not then do something else. this isent a mulit-million dollor game like microsoft or other big companys make where there is huge teams workin on it to perfect it for mass selling this is a "small" online game like so many others out there that probally will never be 100% or even close to being "complete". So back to what i wanted to say to begin with is that stop being so un-constructive on the fourms and when in meetings and take a chill pill the world isent going to end if u dont get what u want and i know ppl have been workin and askin for stuff to be fixed for a long time and it seems like it will never happen and who know mabye it wount but atleast we still have the "core" of the game to play and ppl we know to play it with. I think everyone needs to take a minute and remember when they started playin this and how much "fun" u had before u started to rage on here about stuff which if u think about it only makes u madder and lets u have even less fun playin this game. Now i know im not some "big deal" on this game or even a fleet leader but i have helpd alot of ppl who were startin or have been playin and idk anyone that will talk negitively of me for not being helpful so take what iv said here with a little salt and dont start ragin about how im a no-body and dont know anything about anything
You would have a point if SDE hadn't got huge profits over the NFNA tennure, and you would also have a point if the game was maybe 1/2 years old. However, SDE made a huge amount of money in the "prime" time of this game. I'm sure you can take a minute and see how annoying it is that bugs/exploits etc still exist after having existed for nearly a decade. Or how HA was taken out for a year, not worked on, returned in an even buggier state, and just left.
The important thing with this is context. If this had just been the first incident, then there wouldn't be this anger or backlash from the community. It is that this has happened time and time again.
Years ago, Navyfield and a popular sandbox Space game probably had the same amount of people playing. Sure, that game is subscription based, but Navyfield has microtransactions. The sandbox space game iterated on its content and erased bugs but most importantly, expanded its staff. While they had cuts (mainly on new projects) when player numbers dropped for them, they still had enough players to recover.
SDE need to recover much like that game did. And they need to keep their existing players. They've cost cut (which makes sense for a business especially at the moment), but it is important for them to show the community that they are listening, and that they are working.
Blogs from the Dev's; things detailing what they are working on, their hopes for the games, little things about who they are (i.e. their "dev" name), how they do certain things (e.g. The stages involved in making a new ship). Things like that get the community excited, happy and most importantly, active. Then, when things are getting better, you advertise on Facebook, you put the game on Steam, you put the game on Amazon Digital. But obviously things like the server cap needs to be worked on before that.
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 31. 2012 06:41
devildog8
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Originally Posted by rnelsonbob
I have been here for a couple of years now and i have seen all sorts of bugs and glitches and them annoyin crashes when in game for no aperent reason. I have been alot more active on the fourms latley doing alot of readin and all i can say is stop complainin so dam much its a game u are here to have fun and if u are not then do something else. this isent a mulit-million dollor game like microsoft or other big companys make where there is huge teams workin on it to perfect it for mass selling this is a "small" online game like so many others out there that probally will never be 100% or even close to being "complete". So back to what i wanted to say to begin with is that stop being so un-constructive on the fourms and when in meetings and take a chill pill the world isent going to end if u dont get what u want and i know ppl have been workin and askin for stuff to be fixed for a long time and it seems like it will never happen and who know mabye it wount but atleast we still have the "core" of the game to play and ppl we know to play it with. I think everyone needs to take a minute and remember when they started playin this and how much "fun" u had before u started to rage on here about stuff which if u think about it only makes u madder and lets u have even less fun playin this game. Now i know im not some "big deal" on this game or even a fleet leader but i have helpd alot of ppl who were startin or have been playin and idk anyone that will talk negitively of me for not being helpful so take what iv said here with a little salt and dont start ragin about how im a no-body and dont know anything about anything
you dont have a clue what your talking about, tho this game isnt a huge money maker, it could have been and still could be, and dont think for 2 seconds SDE dosent have millions at it disposal, Its a larger company then you think biggest issues they have are finding Devs that can read and write this old style code
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Re : Meeting Actions
12. 31. 2012 07:31
Obergrattler
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As my previous post were hidden because of "offtopic-trolling" I will elaborate so Brotzeitbeutel (good luck with that) can understand me.
Firstly, I don't see where fleets represent this community, even less their selfproclaimed leaders. It would be half reasonable if real existing megaflotas, that can actually launch an HA for example, were in question. But in this case it's people whose fleets only exist on paper and who themselves play rarely or not at all anymore. These people do not represent anybody but themselves.
Secondly, there are many active players who are not part of a fleet. For some reason they do not exist in all of this. It's fleet leaders, as if that's some sign of competence, it is not. There are some class A buffoons as fleet leaders. That means nothing.
I have a funny thought, how would it be if only people that actually keep this game afloat, meaning they still drop cash on this game, would have a say. Sounds so demcratic to me, if you pay for all of this your opinion matters.
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