The most experienced sub driver on the entire server isn't aware that an SS4 can one-
shot a BB56?

That's kinda embarrassing.

SS don't need to be nerfed.

Your example is WRONG. How much you want to bet that the BB6 had already taken damage and
its SD was lower?

I am the most experienced IJN SS4 driver on Kaiser (I think) and I can't think of any time
a SS has one shot a BB5 or 6 that was undamaged. My sub BO is level 101 and has been a SS
BO since SS1. I have probably 2 dozen BB6 kills including at least one from a SS1. I
have never killed nor seen another sub kill an undamaged BB6.

Until you can prove your statement, its not really worthy of the discussion, but for
discussion sake, here is my 2 cents worth.

The key here is if the BB6's SD is down or not. The IJN SS4 can one shot a BB6 if it is
used in conjunction with good BB4/5 players attacking him. When this type of team play
is occurring, it is a beautiful thing to behold and is great for game play. As it is, too
often a good BB6 will dominate the play wiping out all other players. I'm sure those good
players enjoy the challenge of the SS stalking them, though I am sure it is frustrating at
the same time.

Secondly, if there was an undamaged BB6 who got one shot by a SS, one of two things would
be true:
1) He did not have sufficient defenses to use against sub. A BB6 can carry a lot of
bulge and has plenty of money to spend on a simple sonar escort.
2) If he is playing low armor, he has plenty of speed to run from any sub and did not
play with appropriate caution.

Subs don't need to be nerfed. This is the age old complaint of BB drivers who don't know
the game well enough to properly play and then get upset when they are surprised by a sub.
Subs provide the best "anti-BB" deterence in the game and add a lot of depth to team play.

@V2CxBongRipz:

ok, reduce the statr and dmg radio to NFKR but then give the SS the stats from NFKR...

Or why not reduce the torpedo splash damage radius? You do realize all of our torpedoes
except SS torps have less damage and a smaller splash damage radius then NFKR.

Looking at numbers and from what I've seen in game, I think DJ has a valid point... It
does appear that splash damage (shell and torpedo) is directly proportionate to how far it
lands from the ship with torpedoes getting a much higher multiplier. If this is true, then
the only way to change splash damage done by sub torps is by either:

A. Reducing the torp splash multiplier (which would also affect TB's, kitas etc) or
B. Adjusting the damage sub torps do (which would affect sub balance by nation).

If I had to pick between the lesser of the 2 evils, I would pick A as it has a smaller
impact on overall gameplay and allows IJN SS4 to keep its monty-esque firepower (without
the BB versatility). Either way, changes should also be made in torp speed/range for
anything that may be affected.

But (if I understand this right) a 110 planesman will allow a sub to surface and recharge
its air faster then it uses it.

The 110+ engineers on a sub don't suddenly allow it to do 60k damage to a BB6.

"I've said it before and apparently I need to say it again: the subs themselves are
tolerably balanced as is: it's only when 110+ crews get involved that balance goes out the
damn window."

You cannot balance for at level crews, rather end game crews. BB1-4 were balanced with
that in mind. Same for the DD-CA balance patch. The CV patch was the same way before SDE
threw it out the window with what we have now.

I'll say it again DJ, since you missed it:

Remove splash & duds and you'll see a LOT more BBs getting oneshotted by subs, I promise
you that.

I'll be the first to admit I don't run BBs that often. I find them BORING. Yet when I do
use them, I hardly EVER get sunk by a sub. Why is that? Am I running 255 bulge? Nope, I
run 50 and no more than that. Do I spam HH all the time? Nope, I generally run AA or
supports on my T slots.

Reason I don't worry about subs is because I know them from having played each and every
one of them on a regular basis. I know what they can and cannot do, and as a result, I
know how to avoid them, and deal with them.

DJ, you say that since you can't dodge sub torps or their splash, the subs must be OPed.
So, because you can't do something that I can do, in lower level BBs I might add, there
must be something wrong with subs............ Can you not see how that sounds?

I've said it before and apparently I need to say it again: the subs themselves are
tolerably balanced as is: it's only when 110+ crews get involved that balance goes out the
damn window.

Oh, and yes LJ, you know BB balance. You do not know sub balance. The two are not the same.

I Love Subs