I just got confimation from support that rest/rep DON'T WORK on R slots.

I AGREE with all of snailgod's edits of my post.

We have what is known as a consensus. Anyone care to join?

I'm not gona quote your post's since it wouled make it to long :)

@tomfoolery44

your Dud's idea + Torp Tubes idea collide.... in 1 you ask for dmg reduction, in 2nd
for dmg buff...a small mistake :)
I like both the duds and torp tubes idea...however they shoulden't collide...I think
more tactical play of subs wouled be fun...insted of killing a BB they wouled cripple it
and move on...or they wouled kill a crippeld BB and then moving one....the
suggested incrised relode time takes big part in this.

but yeah I'm all in favor in reducing dud rates A LOT...

Air Time. if you add air speed need's to be lower PERIOD.

Critical Dive, hmm thets a nice idea acctually....let subs move at oround 5knots while
in critical and if they move, they get dmged as they do now...if they don't move...no
dmg :)

Torpedo Aiming, please work on your idea or explain in more detailed....atm all I can
see is KM Sub's geting yet another advantage compared to other nation subs....not
mater what you do as long as they have proxy they don't have to aim, while all
other have to. I agree with Ramp here, lover the proxy trigger range, if it's not
CLINCHING a target it shoulden't go off....or beter yet if I'm selfish a lil....remove
proxy :D

overall not bad ideas :)

--------------------------------------------------------------------

@jimmyawsome

*Allow SS movement at same speeds during critical dive.
Remove 3 second delay for resurfacing.
Make critical dive faster and *less DP loss rate.*

-----------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------

1 - thets just....hmm let me finde more plesent words...hmm ridiculess?
a sub moving 30knots+ while it's in critical...I mean all I can say is LOL...ofcourse I
object to the idea...

2 - the same rate you go down, you go up...kinde of makes sence so why change
thet? faster re-surfecing will give you way to much tactical advantage over
ASW....less surfecing time wouled make HH's and DC's ineffective...

3 - 3s is just fine for critical dive, agein as in nr.2 you wouled have to much of an
advantage vs ASW making HH's or DC useless + add the incrised HH's fuse idea here
and you get a bunch of useless ASW....wich you shoulden't have...as for DP
loss...sure make it A LIL less

other ideas are fine thoe, O.o

FYI to FM my last post wasen't a flame, I clearly stated with what I don't agree and
WHY....I all so diden't call anybody names NOR when't offtopic...so I just have to say
lol...

cheers
Megadone

"Sorry, SS have gunners on R slot not T slot. My rep and rest do not work on R slots and
I sent in a support ticket to ask why. This needs to be changed. Either EVERYONE gets
rep/rest to work on the ship or NO ONE does. Also, the respect issue in my post to
megadone applies to you."

That's because your torpedo men should be there? I doubt that any sub driver goes out and
uses surface guns only. Also, it's not like BBs put reps or rests in R-slots or T-slots (I
carry AA).
I'm not sure about your R-slots (I'm sorry about previous confusion; I consider main
weaponry R-slots) but reps and rests work in mine.

"CHANGES I AM IN FAVOR OF INCLUDE,
Restorers and repairers should work on SS R slots.
Ability to remove the guns and gun weight.
Allow SS movement at same speeds during critical dive.
Remove 3 second delay for resurfacing.
Make critical dive faster and *less DP loss rate.
Increase HH/DC fuse times.
Change color of HH to be more easily recognized.
Sonar should "ping" about the radius of a smoke bomb so SS can be anywhere inside.
*If the rest/rep can be changed to work on SS R slots no change to DP loss rate."

1. They work on mine, not sure about you though.
2. Fully in favor of.
3. Then no firing torps during crit dive.
4. No, because then at no air, you will still be able to dip in and out and not take
damage momentarily.
5. Partially in favor of. Only prem HH need adjusting.
6. Well, it's not that hard to find out if they are HH or DC. And if you're talking about
when the shells are in the air, they are darkened and I can always tell the difference
between them.
6. Not the size of a smoke bomb. Maybe slightly smaller than the size of a H44. That would
avoid giving you smoke bomb cover the entire time you're underwater with the added benefit
that normal guns can't touch you.

CHANGES I AM IN FAVOR OF INCLUDE,
Restorers and repairers should work on SS R slots.
Ability to remove the guns and gun weight.
Allow SS movement at same speeds during critical dive.
Remove 3 second delay for resurfacing.
Make critical dive faster and *less DP loss rate.
Increase HH/DC fuse times.
Change color of HH to be more easily recognized.
Sonar should "ping" about the radius of a smoke bomb so SS can be anywhere inside.
*If the rest/rep can be changed to work on SS R slots no change to DP loss rate.

Unless you are capable of making these changes no need to respond. Just state what
you are in favor of since neither you nor I have the power to change any of it.

I have hidden over 20 posts no more flaming.


This is not post trash until your point is proven you get 1 reply to a suggestion that is
it this flaming will end. If you do not like this then do not post in this topic those are
your choices.

"Duds:
I think this is one of the easiest and most necessary changes that need to be made.
Yes, torpedoes sometimes failed to detonate in real life, but who cares? Based on
this precedent should planes also randomly crash due to engine failure? Should BBs
encounter random mechanical problems? I don뭪 think so. This should be removed. If
the current dud rate is 30% just make the new dud rate zero and reduce damage by
30%. In the current game, a salvo of 8 torps from an IJN SS4 could contain 4 duds or
no duds. Why should one ship survive the same circumstances that instantly sink
another?"

My idea on duds was to remove them completely and remove splash damage as the
counter. Just like duds don't make a lot of sense, torpedoes going off 300-400 yards
(simulated) away from the ship shouldn't cause damage. Hell, torpedoes shouldn't
even explode at the end of their run. The only proximity damage a torpedo should do
is if it's extremely close to the ship..but even then I think all SS torpedoes should be
contact-only. You shouldn't reward the player for missing their target or punish the
player that dodges the torps only to be damaged/killed by their splash damage..

"Sonar:
This is where the cat and mouse game between destroyers and submarines could
really become more fun. Submarine detection should be partially based on the
amount of noise that sub is making (as in real life). At certain speeds, ships with
sonar will be able to hear them at different ranges. Sub Overheat: Detection at
longer range
Sub Full Speed: Detection at normal range Sub Half Speed/Crush Depth: Sub
undetectable, unless ASW ship is stopped (This would be fun) Sub Stopped (Running
Silent): Sub undetectable"

I suggetsed something similar with my battery suggestion, but it was a bit more in-
depth then that. I don't agree at making the sub undetectable at half-speed, and I
don't agree at making the ASW ship stop. The sub can already kill most ASW ships
with 1 or 2 torps..The ASW presenting an easier target to the very ship it's trying to
kill doesn't really make a lot of sense to me.

The only time the submarine should be undetectable or near-undetectable is when
it's not moving or hardly moving at all. And in this instance, it should also be at lt's
least vulnerable because it could stay submerged for the greatest amount of time.

Slower speed = More time submerged = Less detectability
Higher speed = Less time submerged = More detectability

@snailgod
Sorry, SS have gunners on R slot not T slot. My rep and rest do not work on R slots and
I sent in a support ticket to ask why. This needs to be changed. Either EVERYONE gets
rep/rest to work on the ship or NO ONE does. Also, the respect issue in my post to
megadone applies to you.

@tomfoolery44
Nice post. The only thing I disagree with is that a SS needs positioning skill and the only
reason I get close is to have torps in range for second or third salvo as I chase a running
40 knt BB with my submerged 34 knt SS. I would prefer not to have to be so close but
the game mechanic demands it.


***LOLZ The incredible shrinking thread.

The current state of submarine warfare reminds me of a glorified game of
Rock/Paper/Scissors. A sub can do very little to stop a decent ASW ship, and ASW ship can
do nothing against a BB, and a BB can뭪 to a whole lot against a sub on the loose near
their BB line. These are some ideas I have for making each game in a sub more fun,
unique, and the results of that game more dependent on skill. There are both nerfs and
buffs in here; I leave it to others to decide the correct balance of these changes.

Duds:
I think this is one of the easiest and most necessary changes that need to be made. Yes,
torpedoes sometimes failed to detonate in real life, but who cares? Based on this
precedent should planes also randomly crash due to engine failure? Should BBs encounter
random mechanical problems? I don뭪 think so. This should be removed. If the current
dud rate is 30% just make the new dud rate zero and reduce damage by 30%. In the current
game, a salvo of 8 torps from an IJN SS4 could contain 4 duds or no duds. Why should one
ship survive the same circumstances that instantly sink another?

Air Time:
Because of the new patch, subs draw more fire from BBs while they are crossing no-man뭩
land because there is now more incentive to do so. Subs are also taking more damage from
those same salvos so naturally they must start their dive from further back then they used
to. This has turned sub driving into even more of a suicide mission than it used to be.
Air time should be increased to allow subs a chance of both doing damage and surviving the
game.

ASW Ships:
Hedgehogs and depth charges are both very powerful, but there are not that many good ASW
ships because good players are busy playing their high level ships with more XP, Creds,
and Support slots. To fix this, I propose an ASW class remodel option for every nations
DD3 available at around lvl 50. These ships should will be available for all shiplines,
because all shiplines go through DD3뭩. This will allow for higher lvl players to play
ASW and break up the grind on their Kongo, Bogue or whatever.

Critical Dive:
I think critical dive should be changed to what we think of as 밹rush depth?in submarine
movies. At this depth submarines can still move, but they take damage as they do now.
Currently, critical dives take away all of your momentum and usually don뭪 let you escape
anything besides a torp wall, if your opponent is skilled.

Sonar:
This is where the cat and mouse game between destroyers and submarines could really become
more fun. Submarine detection should be partially based on the amount of noise that sub
is making (as in real life). At certain speeds, ships with sonar will be able to hear
them at different ranges.
Sub Overheat: Detection at longer range
Sub Full Speed: Detection at normal range
Sub Half Speed/Crush Depth: Sub undetectable, unless ASW ship is stopped (This would be fun)
Sub Stopped (Running Silent): Sub undetectable

Torpedo aiming:
Right now, submarine drivers best chance for success is to spam all of their torps at
close range, not giving the target a chance to dodge. Skill is not a huge factor here,
either for the sub driver aiming or the target dodging. The simple fix here is to
increase the range of torps and also increase in time it takes a torpedo to activate,
while also decreasing the range at which enemy ships can see your torps. This will
eliminate short range spamming, which takes no skill, and force players to aim their shots
well. It may even reward BBs who zig-zag (as in real life).

Torpedo reload:
Torpedoes should take about as long to reload as hedgehogs. This will force drivers to
pick their shots well. Also it will introduce the now seldom used tactic of firing then
leaving, as opposed to the current system of sub chasing BB across map waiting to see
which will last longer, the subs air or the BBs bulge.

Torpedo Tubes:
Subs should have less tubes and each torpedo should do more damage. Keep the damage
potential of each sub the same but put a bigger premium on aiming well.

Obviously there would be some balance issues with all of these changes, but you can always
tinker with torp damage to balance things out.

Gentlemen....that is all

"My BB or my SS.

Which of those ships can overheat @ 38 knots for 75 seconds?
Which of those ships can withstand and repair damage from multiple salvos of shells?
Which ship at level 65, nets more EXP in a loss than the level 74 ship earns in a win?
Which ship has to respect EVERY ship that opposes it all the way down to the lowly FF?
Which ship rep/rest work in T slots?"

1. Both.
2. It used to be SS more than BBs.... But now it's partially fixed.
3. Yeah, that is a problem. Torp EXP needs to be fixed. But, you can't count PBBs for
obvious reasons, using a BB1 at lvl 60 is pure torture. With a loss, you get 10k max.
4. Both. You should respect everyone in the game unless they disrespect you first.
5. Both.

SweenyTodd wrote:

*can we get back on subject??? come on guys suggestion forum not verbal fighting

speaking of which ss speed can on surface should be 40 knts, below 35 knts

DCs need a nerf bad, as an asw ship its way to easy to kill yourself*

----------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------

1 - agreed, it's becoming jimmy's derailing topic agein...

2 - lol thets just wrong, and I object :D
considering the last surface dmg patch to subs, I don't minde them keeping 40 knots
ON SURFACE FOR NOW, this will need re-adjustemnts if Sub T5-T6 come out.

however giving them 35 knots underwater is just RIDICULESS....ther are a BUNCH of
high lvl ships(BB/CV) wich can't break the 34 knots speed...let alone going 40
knots...I'm pretty sure you do realise if a BB goes 38-40 knots and Sub behinde him
35 knots, sub will stay in touch(if it wasen't in range before it got spoted, at wich
point BB is dead)meaning thet BB will not outrun it as IT SHOULED .... so no the
35knots is stupid, Subs need to work for the kill PERIOD, chasing them down is a NO
NO simple as thet.

3 - agreed

cheers
Megadone