Yay, another sub thread! This one might actually have a reasonable argument over the past 7 pages....
*reads*

Nope, just more "wah, don't nerf. That would be unfair."

As for the rankings thing, I always love when that argument finds its way in to a thread. When you can't argue with someone's point, admonish their stats as inferior.

You do realize that Lukas has...like...three or four accounts with ships on them, right? I would assume he has 800+ sub kills spread over his accounts. No, it isn't as totally awesome as your, but it's pretty stupid to make a distinction about someone's account like that without knowing where they play their ships.

The next time you post about a BB topic, I'm going to make the same graphic and not worry about arguing against your points, since you don't know as much as I do about BB play.

You can ask Lukas how often I tell him to knock it off when he is making similarly stupid arguments. I usually don't post it on the forums because I talk to him on TS or on Jedi's forums, but that's neither here nor there.

Yes, you use main account...but that's the point. Why even use stats to advance your argument? Everyone knows that people play multiple accounts and the people discussing this have played NF for years. Lowering one's self to that point just shows you can't combat the actual argument.

Lukas usually starts arguments like that all the time if it is a new account that doesn't even have the level for BB456. And, he has the time spent discussing and working on balance to back it up. Of course, he also can actually discuss a balance argument with ship stats or technical points that many others cannot.

If someone is low level or doesn't have the level for a ship or doesn't spend time testing, then it is a valid point to say that they don't have that experience. However, using the specific idea for a stats seems questionable since the stats are mostly meaningless and a poor analysis of someone's understanding of balance past the idea of "yeah, they've played long enough".

I am confident that I've questioned Lukas' arguments more than enough.

You completely missed the point about the BB play thing. I'm saying it is a stupid thing to do. And, here you show how silly it is. You claim that you are just taking the main accounts to prove a point, but when questioning your stats...you say someone else will back you up and you play other accounts. So, with that in mind, it seems kinda stupid to admonish the stats on Lukas' main account when you, yourself, are saying that...to defend yourself...you will have others back up your opinion.

Do you see what I'm saying? You can't admonish the stats on Lukas' main account, while you defend yourself by saying you have multiple accounts and people that will defend your play. I can compare my account to your account in BB kills just like you are comparing your account and Lukas in sub kills. Now, you say that for your argument, it is valid to show that he knows nothing. But, in my argument, you say that someone else can backup your BB play and you have other accounts with BB kills. That is both sides of the argument and you are changing your stance based on whether it helps you.

And, even after all of this, you say to go look at the rankings to determine who the real players are...*sigh*

Yes, lukas also said that he does that to kings11 when he is personally atacking people on ONF. yet, he never stops. I don't care if you tell LJ that it's an invallid argument. That only happens behind closed doors and is impossble to prove.

I posted that to stop LJ from ever trying to use that argument again and in public here for everyone to see.

Am not changing anything, it simply shows that I can win in any situation using non-sense arguments like "I'm better then you" that LJ loves to use. Not to mention he only respond to people who are below him.

People who actually make valid arguments he ignores because he knows he can't give better arguments against them.

Countless people including myself have given arguments to why SS are not overpowered. For someone like LJ with that kind of stat which is not 2, not 3, not 4, but 5 times less SS kills then a balanced player such as myself shouldn't be saying OMG SS overpowered, NERF NOW!!!

Gtdawg you are a great BB player, yet, my stat doesn't show below average BB kills. Am more a CV player then anything else. I have played all classes of ship in more configuration(even the nub ones) that I can even remember. Hell I even have the Hood.

LJ comes here and brag about his 5 SS4 and pretend he knows about SS. I know true SS players with 5 SS4 and every single one of them surpasses me in SS kills. That's the point.

LJ claims he knows more about SS, while clearly that is not the case.

Stats and achievements don't tell the whole story, but it does tell a story.

This thread is stupid.

So here's my opinion in the shortest way possible and then I'll be gone:

SS are overpowered. They're also underpowered. ASW is broken. The SS line is fitted poorly into the original game and should be corrected. This has nothing to do with adapting, nerfing, crying about overpowered, etc, etc. This is about improving an aspect of this game to make it more enjoyable.

DJ out.

It takes you 8 torps IJN to kill 255 bulge?
It takes me 6 torps in my UK SS to kill 255 bulge on a qv.